[Date Prev][Date Next][Thread Prev][Thread Next][Date Index][Thread Index]
DAM-L Controversy over Energy Exports/ MB - CBC report
N.B. Donne Flanagan is an assistant to the premier of Manitoba
----- Forwarded message from Donne Flanagan -----
X-Sender: dflanaga@mts.net
X-Apparently-To: harmful-hydro@yahoogroups.com
To: harmful-hydro@yahoogroups.com
From: Donne Flanagan <dflanaga@mts.net>
Subject: [harmful-hydro] CBC Radio Interview
SUBJECT: Controversy over energy exports - Cross Lake First
Nation
SOURCE: CBC Radio, 7:40 a.m., Tuesday, April 24th, 2001
Clip # 11312274
Host: And as Heather told you in the news, Manitoba Hydro's
reputation's getting a beating across the border this week.
Yesterday, the New York Times ran a full-page ad that accused Hydro
of cold-hearted abuse of human rights and the environment.
That's a
quote from the ad. The ad claims that hydroelectric projects have
done extensive damage to the Pimicikamak Cree Nation, formerly known
as Cross Lake in northern Manitoba. The ad is aimed at shareholders
in Hydro's biggest U.S. customer, Xcel Energy. Shareholders are
being asked to support a resolution that will come before Xcel's
annual general meeting in Minneapolis tomorrow. Anne Stewart is a
lobbyist for the Pimicikamak Cree Nation in Minneapolis and Glenn
Schneider speaks for Manitoba Hydro. They both join us now. Hello.
Anne Stewart, Pimicikamak Cree Nation Lobbyist:
Good morning.
Glenn Schneider, Manitoba Hydro:
Good morning.
Host: Anne Stewart, if I could turn to you first. What's the
intent of this resolution that will come before the Xcel shareholders
on Wednesday?
Stewart: Actually, I'd like to ask Mr. Schneider a question
because after you scheduled this interview with me and with him, I
heard that Xcel Energy is freaking out, and so they are... or
Manitoba Hydro is or Manitoba's taxpayers are paying for Crees
who
support hydro destruction to come down and hold a press conference
after the vote and after the annual meeting. I'd just like to
know
what Mr. Schneider hopes to accomplish by this ill-timed tactic?
Host: Well... But, perhaps, Anne Stewart, we just need to get kind
of the table set here to understand the issues that play, and then
these things will be discussed in this conversation. But, we do need
to know what the intent of this resolution is that will come before
the Xcel shareholders in Minneapolis?
Stewart: The intent of the resolution is to ask Xcel's
management to support real renewable energy that does least harm to
the environment and to the native peoples.
Host: And, is it your intention to ask the Xcel shareholders to
stop buying hydro from Manitoba Hydro?
Stewart: It is the shareholders intention to separate Xcel
from being complicit (sic) in this environmental destruction.
Host: So then, the bottom line is you want them to stop buying
hydro from Manitoba Hydro. Do I have that correct?
Stewart: Well, I think that we have more alternatives here.
Today's Minneapolis Star Tribune has an excellent article in the
business column about how much Minnesota is doing for its
renewable... to develop its renewable energy resources here, and
that's something that Xcel can play a very large... a larger role
in
assisting.
Host: Now just briefly, what do you say is the impact of Manitoba
Hydro's developments in northern Manitoba, particularly as it
affects
the Pimicikamak Cree Nation?
Stewart: High rates of youth suicides, poverty, mass
unemployment and of course, the ongoing environmental destruction
from running a hydraulic system in a way that doesn't imitate
nature.
Host: Now, I need to turn to Glenn Schneider from Manitoba Hydro
for some response to these comments from Anne Stewart. Glenn
Schneider, what's your response?
Schneider: Well, this is a... part of a campaign that's been
waged now by Cross Lake and Ms. Stewart in the Minneapolis and
Wisconsin areas for a couple of years now, trying basically to put
pressure on Manitoba Hydro and the government to meet whatever
demands Cross Lake has, in terms our ongoing negotiations. I think
everybody would recognize that these issues of... Cross Lake's
outstanding issues aren't going to be resolved in the U.S.. This
is
simply a pressure tactic. A leverage, and in making these outlandish
claims in the U.S., they're really, not only defaming the
reputation
of Manitoba Hydro and our ability to do business in that market, but
they're also, in fact, defaming the reputation of Manitobans and
Canadians.
Host: What amount of hydro to you sell to Xcel in the United States?
Schneider: Well, we sell about 30 to 40 percent of our annual
output actually to the export market in general, and a good part of
that, and I couldn't tell you this morning exactly what that is,
but
a good part of that is to NSP (sic).
Host: So, they are an important customer?
Schneider: Very important.
Host: Anne Stewart, who's paying for this ad? Who paid for this
ad
in the New York Times?
Stewart: Private donors.
Host: Private donors.
Stewart: And, I would add that Mr. Schneider is right when he
says that this issue needs to be resolved in Canada. But, the debate
is happening here because these are the American customers and
shareholders of Xcel Energy who are saying we're learning about
this
electricity. It's not sustainable, according to our definition,
and
it's essentially the electric equivalent of goods made with slave
labour and we want no part of it.
Host: So, Mr. Schneider, what's Manitoba Hydro doing to resolve
the issues to do with the impact of Manitoba Hydro projects on the
Pimicikamak Cree Nation?
Schneider: Well, as you probably know Terry, we have settlement
agreements with four out of the five Northern Flood Agreement bands,
and PCN remains the only band that has not yet arrived at some
agreement and they, in fact, walked away from a $100-million proposed
settlement. So, we... However, despite that and despite the lobbying
in the U.S., which is really defaming us, we have... we continue to
meet with them on a monthly basis, and sometimes weekly, to try and
settle some specific arbitration claims to try and meet in a general
way to try and implement the NFA. And by the way, you know, hundreds
of thousands of dollars are spent annually on fees to the band
members participating in those discussions to their consultants and
lawyers, as well. So, they're very well supported and you know,
it's... You can tell by some of the rhetoric that's employed
by Anne
Stewart that this is a very ideological camp, that they are engaged
in this... really, it's a pressure tactic on Manitoba Hydro.
But,
the resulting impact is really a threat to our exports, a threat to
our low rates here in Manitoba. I don't know how Ms. Stewart
can
claim that hydroelectricity is not renewable. But, by her twisted
definition apparently, it's not.
Host: And why do you say that this is defamation? You... That's
fairly strong language when you talk about the campaign on the
Pimicikamak.
Schneider: A lot of the information that they put forward is
really a, you know, they take a small example of impacts from the
hydroelectric stations, and no one would argue that there haven't
been impacts, and exaggerate them. For example, they claim that 32-
million acres have been flooded, or rendered inaccessible, whatever
that is. The total amount of acres impacted in northern Manitoba is
like, in the order of 2,000 acres. That's a wild exaggeration.
Host: Anne Stewart? Glenn Schneider says you exaggerate?
Stewart: Well, if I exaggerate, I'd like him to take a look at
current Minnesota legislation that's pending in the State House
here. The definition of renewable energy technologies includes
solar, wind, hydroelectric with a capacity of less than 60 mega-watts
or biomass, and the projects up north are large projects. I think by
now, with the Three Gorges Project, with what went on in Quebec, with
the PVA project, which we would never repeat hopefully in the United
States, with what's going on in Africa and India, people know
that
large hydro projects are simply not sustainable energy under...
Host: But, your president mentioned, just on the weekend, that he
thought that buying more hydroelectricity from abroad, particularly
Canada, sounded like a good idea?
Stewart: Well, good for him. I'll just sooner or later have
to call him up and talk to him. After all, I...
Schneider: Terry, you know that a plant like the limestone
plant, which is quite large by anybody's definition and which was
put
in place with very minimal environmental impact, puts a lie to that
theory that large hydro dams are... always have large environmental
consequences. It's simply not the case.
Host: Well, we won't resolve the whole thing here this morning,
but
we do appreciate both of you for laying out your positions for us.
Thank you so much for your time.
Stewart: Thank you.
Host: Bye-bye. Anne Stewart is a lobbyist for the Pimicikamak Cree
Nation and she's based in Minneapolis. Glenn Schneider speaks
for
Manitoba Hydro, and what do you think about this? Are you concerned
about the impact this campaign will have on Manitoba Hydro and the
economy of this province? Or, do you think that the U.S. should pull
the plug on hydro exports from Manitoba until all environmental and
human rights issues are resolved? Give us your thoughts on the
Listener Line. 788-3205. E-mail radio990@cbc.ca .
- 30 -
----- End of forwarded message from Donne Flanagan -----