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Re: FW: comments on <draft-ietf-spki-cert-theory-02.txt>

On Sun, 26 Jul 1998, Ian Brown wrote:

>>Regarding cyber-world misconceptions, some think that by escaping
>>names one can escape reality.  Others think that credit-cards deals
>>would not need names or any real-life id, just assets. Surely, the
>>merchant gets paid regardless, even if you use a false name.
>This is, after all, what matters to the merchant.

No,since (as my text went) the merchant faces a non-zero risk of
accepting a fake and untraceable name -- which he can't tolerate
because he would bear the risk alone. NOT the bank, mind you --
because the bank can cancel any payment made to the merchant up to
one year AFTER the sales and (worse) the merchant has its merchant
account cancelled if more than 1%(one percent) of transactions are

So, the merchant MUST depend on traceable names -- specially with
credit cards!

>>But this is not the end of id fraud. The bank still goes after the
>>money...and uses the law against fraudulent practices to enforce the
>>cardholder agreement, or criminal statues.
>The bank wants to catch the person who made the fraudulent
>transaction. The name on the card is not likely to help them do

The merchant pays!

>>If Mr. X uses his wife's
>>credit-card, Mr. X is technically committing id fraud, and
>If he does this with Mrs. X's permission, nobody cares. The merchant
>gets paid from Mrs. X's account. Mrs. X does not scream "fraud" to
>her credit card company. 

Who can guarantee that? Further, who can guarantee that Mrs. X's card
was used with her unlawful permission? 

And, who pays the bill if such assumptions fail? The merchant pays!

>Mr. X would have to be exceptionally stupid to commit card fraud
>with his wife's card. The *merchant* doesn't know who the card
>belongs to, but the card issuer does. 

;-) No, not stupid. Two cases, for example:

1. Naive: Mr. X believs that Mrs. X will pay for his motel

2. Fraudulent: the card was stolen from Mrs. X

Please note that none of this can be guessed by the merchant.


Ed Gerck
Dr.rer.nat. E. Gerck                     egerck@novaware.cps.softex.br
-- Internet saves trees, WebBoy UMC saves PCs, you save time and money

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